Why can the EPL not get VAR right



  • Clear hand ball by trent before Liverpool scored at the other end. The refs never go to look at the monitor so not really an assistant the ref on the pitch is more like an assistant to the video ref



  • @Black-wolf if you're going to give that as a handball against taa then you have to give it handball against Bernardo Silva first



  • @Ddr i never saw an angle of it hitting Bernardo’s arm but maybe that's the reason. Still dont think the EPL have implemented VAR well at all compared to all the other leagues using it



  • @Black-wolf they've just said on commentary that the epl have said there was no reaction time for taa to move his arm out of the way and on top if that his arm wasnt in an unnatural position.

    But yeah, if you watch Silva is tackled and the ball hits his arm which is what takes the ball towards taa



  • I'm conflicted on whether that penalty should have been given.

    That said, there are so many examples of VAR being used badly this season. Like no penalty for Leicester yesterday or the Sheffield United goal being disallowed.

    I can't only put it down to incompetence of the folks operating VAR.



  • @NewUser303261 thats what i mean its being used dreadfully. The Sheffield one yesterday should have stood imo because when its that close they should revert back to whether the lines man could have called it. He was actually ruled offside by camera blur and not because he gained an unfair advantage. If they cant come up with a decision using VAR in a short specified time then a foal should be left to stand



  • @Black-wolf not only was it one of those that are so close they shouldn't be changing the original decision, if you really look closely the spurs players head is clearly playing him onside.

    In principle I'm in favour of VAR, but I'm gobsmacked by the lack of competency it's being used with



  • @Black-wolf just thinking about it, you know they changed the law so that an attacking team has a goal disallowed if there is a handball in the build up(even if its accidental), I wonder if that's also the case that you cant get a penalty if there's a handball in the build up? Dont think I've seen it discussed at any point



  • @NewUser303261 i have the same standing on as you. I really am for it but at the monent the are over using it and its having to big an impact on the game



  • @Ddr silvas was on the run so couldnt do anything about it..arnold was static with his arm out so clear handball this VAR is a joke...plus manes push on sterling aswell 2 clear pens would have changed the game never a 3-1 game



  • It’s such a shame that the biggest game of the season has been totally over shadowed by the fact VAR has proven itself as completely incompetent yet again. They’ve completely bottled it yesterday, if Liverpool hadn’t have scored, they’d have given the penalty, but I think cause they didn’t want to have to rule out a goal and take it all the way back to the other end for a penalty they just decided to ignore it. Even if people are saying Bernardo handled the ball first then they should’ve given a Liverpool free kick, as you can’t just let play carry on ‘as city handled it first’ and ignore the Liverpool handball. They have to massively rethink this system or remove it, I was pro VAR when it came in wanted to give it a chance, however after that game yesterday and the Everton v Spurs game it is absolutely ridiculous the decisions they make



  • I didn’t think it was a penalty purely because Bernardo Silva handled it first and then City would have gained an unfair advantage and we’d be saying City shouldn’t of had a penalty. Liverpool were the better team and deserved the 3 points! They’ve won the league and there’s nothing no one can do about it! They’re on another level.



  • Brexit .



  • The problem isn't so much VAR as it is the "new rules".

    Everybody seems to have forgotten the pre-season rush to buy established penalty takers on the index because it was announced that penalties will be given EVERY TIME the ball strikes a defenders hand in the box, REGARDLESS OF INTENTION, NATURAL ARM POSITION OR PROXIMITY TO THE BALL BEING KICKED.

    Unless I missed it, these rules are still in effect? ?

    I think they are absolutely ridiculous rules and we should just go back to the ruling of "intentional" handball. In which case, Man City would have had a penalty on Sunday because Trent did have his arm out, intentionally making his surface area wider.

    Some of the offside calls VAR are getting involved with and calling INCORRECTLY though is a joke!

    Just like with failed IPO releases on FI, the premier league should just suspend VAR until everything is clear 😁



  • Strangely England is seen as an example of VAR working by quite a few other countries. Personally I hate it full stop and think its spoiling the game, how far are they going to go back.. Will a goal be disallowed because the throw in 5 minutes ago was taken from wrong place.

    Re the TAA thing though. Is the clear and obvious rule still in place - looked to me like one you shouldn't overturn as it wasn't a clear and obvious error. Probably the correct call as it probably wasn't a deliberate handball and you are in danger of forwards just aiming for the arm if you give them. Difficult though as next week it could be given and I doubt you will ever get it consistent.

    Not sure on the rules re Silva and whether it invalidates any penalty claim.

    Kompany made a bit of a plonker of himself on sky though. Whether you think it's a penalty or not, you can't stop the game everytime there is a penalty appeal... If you do that then VAR really will kill the game.



  • It's the consistency problem that's really annoying me the most, there's every chance that situation will happen next game week and the penalty will be given. If I was a Man City fan I'd have come away from that game absolutely pulling my hair out, people laugh off the Sterling penalty appeal but there has been a few occasions where Salah has had an arm in his back, arched his back and hit the deck, and got given a penalty. As I said it really is the consistency for me, players/fans are going into games having no clue what the referee is going to give, there is such grey areas about these rules and I really think it needs to be taken out until a solution is provided going forward.



  • @ChazFI123 said in Why can the EPL not get VAR right:

    It's the consistency problem that's really annoying me the most, there's every chance that situation will happen next game week and the penalty will be given. If I was a Man City fan I'd have come away from that game absolutely pulling my hair out, people laugh off the Sterling penalty appeal but there has been a few occasions where Salah has had an arm in his back, arched his back and hit the deck, and got given a penalty. As I said it really is the consistency for me, players/fans are going into games having no clue what the referee is going to give, there is such grey areas about these rules and I really think it needs to be taken out until a solution is provided going forward.

    How though?

    It just isn't possible. Is a push a penalty or not? If it is then how much of a push does it have to be. Putting your hand on someone's back can't be a penalty. A full blown push has to be a penalty. Somewhere in the middle and it depends.

    How do you write a rule to cover the degree of pushness. It just isn't possible.

    Same with handball. You just can't make it black and white unless you say everytime the ball hits an arm it is a penalty which would be terrible. Really terrible.

    There will always be grey areas. It's just not possible to avoid them so you have to get on with it. I have sympathy with city for the reasons you say.. Next week they could well be given. But they aren't why city lost the game. They lost the game because Liverpool were far more incisive and clinical. That's what they need to worry about.



  • @mike778 but my point is, is that penalties have been given for the exact same thing before, but because the appeal was against Liverpool a lot of fans just laughed it off, whereas the exact same has been given against Salah. I personally think more pushes should get given as in this instance Mane had 0 interest in playing the ball so why should he be allowed to just push him. But my problem isn't about my personal opinion on fouls/decisions, there is literally 0 consistency. My point is, is that how can football possibly carry on with these decisions, where one week something will be given and one week it won't. I'd rather they went back to how it was before and at least you could say it was down to human error, rather than the wide array of problems that VAR keeps presenting now.



  • @ChazFI123 said in Why can the EPL not get VAR right:

    @mike778 but my point is, is that penalties have been given for the exact same thing before, but because the appeal was against Liverpool a lot of fans just laughed it off, whereas the exact same has been given against Salah. I personally think more pushes should get given as in this instance Mane had 0 interest in playing the ball so why should he be allowed to just push him. But my problem isn't about my personal opinion on fouls/decisions, there is literally 0 consistency. My point is, is that how can football possibly carry on with these decisions, where one week something will be given and one week it won't. I'd rather they went back to how it was before and at least you could say it was down to human error, rather than the wide array of problems that VAR keeps presenting now.

    I would agree prefer no VAR but you still get the inconsistencies. You always have and always will. They do tend to even themselves out partly because players get a reputation for diving.

    The problem with giving more fouls is most of them are dives to some extent - certainly sterling dived yesterday the same way mane and salah have in the past.

    Maybe there needs to be free kicks in the box for stuff like that which is a bit of a foul but largely play acting.



  • @mike778 VAR needs to be only used for clear errors by the officials. This level of scrutiny they are using for offsides is insane they are actually going down as far as pixels which is something a linesman could never do before so dont make that the margins they play by now.


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