Order Books



  • Could anyone give me an insight into how order books would potentially work with FI?



  • @Collymore10 This is worth a read



  • @Keegans-Bluff thank you I’ll have a read!



  • Thanks @Keegans-Bluff for sharing that link, a very informative piece and well written. The only thing I have yet to understand with order books is how it will impact my portfolio value. I understand the buying and selling but what sets the price on players I hold and have no intention of selling for the foreseeable future?

    Tried to find a random example from my portfolio at the £2 price. Closest is Upamecano with a current buy price of £2.03. If there are various sell orders up to £2.25 (+22p) and buy orders down to £1.70 (-33p) does his value in my portfolio change? Does the number of buy and sell orders affect his value?

    Thanks in advance if someone can explain this. Not fond of change but order books should be a positive and hopefully attract some high net worth individuals.



  • @Martyn-B great question! I would assume the price is still set by the house as is today and the price moves with the actual number of shares bought/sold (in other words, orders fulfilled) like at present but that could be a bad assumption.



  • I am going to be doing a YouTube this week explaining them so I will post it in here when I do. I'm very excited for them.



  • @Keegans-Bluff Thank you for that, looks like only a positive for the platform if executed correctly but will need a fair amount of learning for me to maximise the opportunity.



  • @Tom7471 cool thanks



  • Sounds really interesting



  • Bumping this thread. So nobody is able to answer my question above with any confidence??



  • @Martyn-B I would assume not as it would be open to market manipulation. Get a group of people to put in sell orders quickly to drag the price down, or buy orders to drag the price up. Would surely work the same way it does now, with buys and sells.



  • @ZakStag Thanks, that is also what I am assuming but it is a hell of an assumption!!



  • @Martyn-B its a good point and is my main issue im failing to grasp about it. The reason being is that currently a player can only go down in value if listed or instant sold but only ISing causes a real drop. If order books are ste to replace IS then a player will never truly lose value as there is no way to reduce the shares in circulation. So im guessing IS will still exist.

    As for a player going up in price he can only truly do so when new shares are issued so a buy price set by FI will still have to exist (im pretty sure order books will reduce how often new shares are issue and slow growth)

    That means for order books to work i can only assume we will still have the upper and lower buy and sell limits, which can be seen as trades between FI and the trader, and then an orders button for everything inbetween.

    I understand order books and FI’s current system but im struggling to see how both will work together or how shares in circulation will affect share value in the way that they do now. If they opt to have share value determined by the average price between buy and sell orders than that could have a catastrophic affect on portfolio values so i cant see that happening.

    My hope is that order books are implemented to work alongside the current system and not replace it completely



  • I would assume but nobody knows...

    Players base market will be work exactly like it is does now. So the base price of a player might be 3 quid. They have an instant sell back to Football Index price to ensure there is always some liquidity but this will probably be with a very big spread say 2 quid.

    If you want to sell a player you can market list them for 2.70. If anyone then tries to buy the player then the price they see on the screen will be 2.70 (or lower if anyone undercuts the 2.70). If somebody buys the player it doesn't affect the base price because no new shares have been offered. If there is nobody trying to sell then you can buy the player at the base price of 3 quid (like now and the base price will increase every 900 bought).

    That seems the best way for me.... Keep existing mechanism with an IS to FI figure in there. But use order books to allow people space to manoeuvre round the spreads and to take advantage of fluctuations in game without being online. Would be a win win for everyone.



  • To me Order Books feels like the White Walkers of the Index - i.e. always on the horizon, but never actually arrive.

    Have FI made any statement about when these will be introduced?



  • Current portfolio value is not really a true figure currently. A share in Robert Huth is not worth 26p. Therefore it doesn't really matter much if FI change they way they calculate this. Hopefully with smaller spreads the figure should be closer to a true value whatever the method.

    However I'm still not convinced orders book will ever be introduced. FI is not like betfair where users can essentially create new shares, or normal stocks where the number of shares is fixed. In FI we have an undetermined (infinite?) number if shares in each player and its FI who decide and trade in the markets accordingly.



  • @NewUser565183 they are happening. Listening to FI’s own senior members of staff in podcasts it was meant be happening towards the end of this season. I believe they had said first half of 2020 although current world events may alter that. They have been confirmed and will be coming soon. They had also spoke of a major overhaul in the tech behind the platform aswell to work alongside Nasdaq and to fix a variety of issues i think they called it project hadron. Think it was on the FI podcast about a month ago and sounded very positve



  • Thanks for the replies about how order books will affect players prices in my portfolio. The more I think about order books the more questions I have.

    Continuing to use Upamecano as my example, I put in a buy order for 100 at £1.75 and have a cash balance of £250. If a seller accepts my buy order in the middle of the night does my buy go through automatically, or do I have one final chance to confirm? If I need to confirm the buy then how long will I have to do this?

    Also can I use my £250 cash balance whilst waiting for my buy order to be fulfilled?? Can I spend £100 of it or will this cancel my Upamecano buy order?

    Could I have a cash balance of £10. Place £1,000 of sell orders, £950 of buy orders and then not log on for a year?

    Would I have to cancel all sell and buy orders before an overseas holiday?

    Something to think about. I mostly understand order books (honestly!!) Thanks in advance.



  • @Martyn-B said in Order Books:

    Thanks for the replies about how order books will affect players prices in my portfolio. The more I think about order books the more questions I have.

    Obviously theres a lot we don't know yet but

    Continuing to use Upamecano as my example, I put in a buy order for 100 at £1.75 and have a cash balance of £250. If a seller accepts my buy order in the middle of the night does my buy go through automatically, or do I have one final chance to confirm? If I need to confirm the buy then how long will I have to do this?

    Unmatched orders should be filled immediately once someone accepts your offer

    Also can I use my £250 cash balance whilst waiting for my buy order to be fulfilled?? Can I spend £100 of it or will this cancel my Upamecano buy order?

    I doubt you'll be able to. You should be able to cancel your buy order if no one has matched it.

    Could I have a cash balance of £10. Place £1,000 of sell orders, £950 of buy orders and then not log on for a year?

    No. FI won't let you bet more than your balance and they almost certainly won't let you place a sell order for shares you don't already own.

    Would I have to cancel all sell and buy orders before an overseas holiday?

    That would be upto you!

    Something to think about. I mostly understand order books (honestly!!) Thanks in advance.



  • When you put in a buy order the money will be removed from your account. Which means Whales will have the top spots on the top players all the time.


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