A Sad Day



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    Thanks to everyone who mention me in the who is the best thread. It was nice and made me happy which is exactly the opposite of what FI have been doing to me for months.
    Yes it’s the Enhanced Due Diligence.
    I’m self employed and run a success small business.
    I did what FI asked me on a piecemeal basis over a period of time. They said ok can we just have a copy of my tax return now! Well it’s with my accountant who is in lock down so I don’t have access to it. I explained this and they said fine send it when you can. The above arrived today.
    My account is suspended and something else will happen on the 12th. As you can see I’ve asked what.
    Luckily I’ve sold most of my profitable trades so I shall just ask for my money back. I should end up £10k for the time on the index.
    I know many of you don’t like people slagging of FI because you are worried about your bets. You should all be worried because FI are going to lose those whales you all want them to have if they treat them like this.
    I shall be writing to Cole sharing my experience. See if he gives a shit. My peak portfolio total was £45k, it’s now £16k. I had another £85k to put in but not now. I’ll buy a rental flat instead. Tenants are less hassle than dealing with FI.
    Good luck to you all. I’ll keep you updated.
    I’m also writing to the ICO because there is no way that sending very sensitive information to a generic email address is protecting your data.



  • @LittleFish hope they sort it out quick mate. Such a shame when their poor processes are compounded by poor customer service.



  • @LittleFish

    Really sorry to hear this.
    I have just done my EDD. My situation sounds very similar to yours as I am self employed. It took about 2 months to be completed and they never told me it was complete. It wasn't until I contacted my account manager last week to find out what was going on and I was told it was complete but no one had bothered to tell me.

    They asked me for proof of income in the form of tax returns and they were happy with screen shots of my 2 previous years but I couldnt provide last years accounts as they are not completed. Lastly they asked for proof of income from the 3 months leading upto my deposit as they couldn't see the tax return I sent screen shots of the 3 months of bank statements showing income coming in and that was good enough for them. Hopefully that could work for you.
    Good luck and hope you get it sorted!



  • @LittleFish

    Sounds like you’ve had it worse than me.

    But I also found the constant DD and EDD requests irritating and invasive. It’s ridiculous the amount and frequency of information they ask for. I’ve never had to send a betting website my P60 or a year’s worth of current account and credit card statements before. I’m sure I gave the banks less when I took out my last mortgage.

    I’ve gradually reduced my portfolio down from £25k to £6k, and will continue further when the time is right. It’s not worth the risk pumping money in when you never know when they’ll suspend your account or block withdrawals, even if temporarily.



  • @ocs123 I know it's frustrating if you're on the wrong side of this, but as a concept FI is hugely risky for money laundering purposes so they've got to go the extra mile. The bank, for example, have probably seen you in person and potentially even been to your house, which immediately makes you a lower risk (I.e. you are who you say you are). FI don't have that luxury. I have to deal with money laundering checks in my job and we don't accept copies of any documents (ie they have to be originals) so we've got a greater chance of making sure they're genuine, but again, FI can't easily do that either. Therefore does mean that they have to be so much more thorough on what they can check.

    I'm not defending the customer service aspect, but taking what you've said as the source of wealth evidence evidence, that sounds pretty sensible (I am assuming in defending FI that you've invested a fair bit; if you've only put a tenner in, I take it back, they've gone way overboard!)



  • @LittleFish meant to say in my above message, hope you get sorted satisfactorily. EDD can be a proper chore.



  • @Mintyfresh thanks for your kind comments. Could you just explain how a tax return can prove source of wealth. As any self employed person knows it is usually the greatest work of fiction since an infinite number of monkeys were each given a typewriter.



  • Such a shame. I hope you get it sorted in the way you want.



  • They must be on one again because I spent 2 months yoyoing with them jan/feb re edd, them taking up to a week to reply each time while my account was suspended and I have a fair whack invested that I couldn't sell if needed, or withdraw even though I had it sat in account.

    Today they've just asked for it again even though I've withdrawn more than I deposited since. I'm tempted like you to withdraw and invest in a buy to let instead as these lot are extremely hard work



  • @LittleFish Well it will show what was declared to HMRC both in terms of the numbers and the nature of the trade. If someone shows they do a bit of gardening and they make a £10k annual profit on their tax return, but they want to pile £100k in, alarm bells are going to be ringing here. It's just one way of checking income. Gambling with undeclared income is literally one of the things these checks are supposed to check/stop, so a tax return that is indeed a work of fiction could be a problem (just to clarify, I am talking in general terms, not your case!)

    I think we're talking big numbers here though. £50 cash in hand ain't right, but of course it goes on and is unlikely to ever show up. People living clearly beyond their (declared) means is much more likely to be picked up on HMRC's radar.

    FI have a problem if they become suspicious of fraudulent behaviour, as not only are they duty bound to report it (prison sentences for individual employees, not just the bosses) but they are not allowed to tell us why there is a problem, as that counts as tipping off which is a criminal offence too!

    They have got to be so careful but that's no excuse for poor service/communication. Hopefully they'll get you sorted soon. You'd like to think it's in their best interest too.



  • @Mintyfresh cheers just to clarify a legal work of fiction. Obviously my accountants job is to minimise tax paid. A tax return doesn't show you just spent £200k on new plant or whatever.
    But I can see why they want it. Been helpful if they asked for it at the beginning.

    And I would add the the DD and the EDD when I withdrew money. Not when a big chunk was deposited in for the bonus. They have been taking commission from that money. Only concerned when I want it back.



  • @LittleFish tax return will show allowances on assets bought, but you're right, it can't and won't cover everything. I know mortgage companies will sometimes ask for an accountant's certificate too, as well as tax returns, for that very reason, but not sure if FI ever do. In any event, not sure everyone would want their accountant knowing how much they've got in here.

    As I said before though, I will defend FI on adhering to the rules, because they have to, but doesn't mean they can be sloppy with the service. Completely agree with you on the timing; these checks should be undertaken with every large deposit, or when cumulative deposits reach a set level, not on withdrawals.



  • @LittleFish I hope you sort this out. That deadline is the time that they'll let you know the outcome of their enquiries, or they'll require additional information. When I did my EDD last month, they responded the day after the deadline requiring additional information.

    It appears to me they are aggressively making sure more "risky" accounts (i.e. non PAYE traders) can be verified beyond reasonable doubt that their source of income is clean. Just one account being discovered by authorities to be dodgy money will lead to FI's licence being revoked.

    I've asked FI in this thread (FI Mark) whether they will move to doing these checks with all account holders BEFORE they can open an account, so that they fall in line with the exchange industry. No reply as yet: https://forums.footballindex.co.uk/topic/17071/the-edd-policy-has-to-change-asap



  • @Londoner said in A Sad Day:

    I've asked FI in this thread (FI Mark) whether they will move to doing these checks with all account holders BEFORE they can open an account, so that they fall in line with the exchange industry. No reply as yet: https://forums.footballindex.co.uk/topic/17071/the-edd-policy-has-to-change-asap

    I made the same point to CS service (in not very polite words). I wasn't bothered about the EDD, it was the fact I was asked for it a year after depositing £100k. And at the same time then asked where I got the £10k I was playing off the year before.
    It seemed a little late in the day to say the least. One thing I have noticed over the last few months are some record fines for betting companies who are not doing proper DD (Betway £11.6m in March). I am guessing that these settlements, combined with the current economic climate, are making for more stringent checks.
    Should all be done before creating an account, simple as that



  • @Mintyfresh they asked for my P60 not my full tax return.



  • @Londoner said in A Sad Day:

    @LittleFish I hope you sort this out. That deadline is the time that they'll let you know the outcome of their enquiries, or they'll require additional information. When I did my EDD last month, they responded the day after the deadline requiring additional information.

    It appears to me they are aggressively making sure more "risky" accounts (i.e. non PAYE traders) can be verified beyond reasonable doubt that their source of income is clean. Just one account being discovered by authorities to be dodgy money will lead to FI's licence being revoked.

    I've asked FI in this thread (FI Mark) whether they will move to doing these checks with all account holders BEFORE they can open an account, so that they fall in line with the exchange industry. No reply as yet: https://forums.footballindex.co.uk/topic/17071/the-edd-policy-has-to-change-asap

    They would never willingly do that. Who in their right mind would go to all this trouble to open an account. It is totally underhand to do it when you've had money in for 18 months and want it back.

    I shall be writing to the Gambling commission expressing my concerns that because of their procedures for checking for Source of Funds FI may be benefiting from illegal activity.

    There I think I can hear my account closing.



  • @LittleFish fair enough, someone else mentioned tax returns earlier so got confused. PAYE cases with P60 should be simpler, hopefully.



  • @Mintyfresh it might of been me. Just checked the email from FI it was P60. I have to say the individual concerned carrying out the EDD has been very professional, other than just freezing my account with no notice and I have no problem with him. I believe like most things with FI the system is flawed. Make it up as you go along management style.



  • @Mintyfresh I don't even know if as a self employed person do I have a P6?. It a cost me £60 to ask my accountant so fuck it I'll see what the terms of closure are first.



  • @LittleFish P60 will be from an employment or pension income, but won't cover self employment. So if you're only self employed, you won't have one. If you've got your own Government Gateway or online tax account, you will be able to get a copy of your SA302, which is the tax calc for the year, without needing to speak to your accountant. It's the closest thing self employed have to a P60 and it's normally these that mortgage companies want for lending purposes.


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