KDB, Messi & City



  • Say if happens - Is Messi joining City a worry for KDBs FI prospects? I’m a current holder of both and my opinion is yes, and I’ll explain why, but wondered what other people think.

    OPEN PLAY:
    Messi and KDB like to work in similar areas of the field (the central/right hand side of the final third). Messi by coming inside onto his left, and KDB by whipping those crosses in and providing through balls between the LB and LCB. With these 2 both demanding the ball and used to being the main man, they’re bound to take some opportunities off each other to make that key chance/assist/goal that scores high on PB.

    SET-PIECES:
    Bound to be shared between the 2. Same with penalties.

    ROTATION/EARLY SUB:
    I think Pep will be far happier resting KDB knowing he has Messi in his side, and vice versa. I don’t think either 1 of them would have to play 90mins every game like they currently are.

    Ultimately they’ll still both score highly, and they may help each other in many ways as City will dominate. But I still think their individual scores may suffer for reasons mentioned above. Messi will obviously win all the MB. KDB never has done and that won’t change.

    Interested to know others thoughts.



  • It's an interesting one as you say. KDB will certainly lose penalties I'd of thought and some PB, but he may gain some more in play assists or goals from working with Messi. They aren't competing for the same PB position, but you'd expect Messi to pick up the most points out of the two for star man. Teams may also try and mark Messi more than KDB, allowing him more space to create chances or get into the box and score goals. It's a really interesting dynamic that I'd love to play out. I hold both atm and wouldn't sell KDB if Messi joined, but I'd certainly monitor the first few games to see how they both score.



  • I think people are going way overboard on Messi personally and I’m happy to not be involved. Apart from the fact that he may still legally remain a Barca player yet get no game time; if he does come to the EPL (can’t see City affording it if a fee is required) then EPL week-in week-out is a whole different prospect than La Liga week-in week-out.m and especially for a 33 year old.

    Yes he’s been a phenomenal player but is now on the downward curve of his career and even though he’ll have star games, I don’t see him pulling up trees or dominating to the levels people think.

    De Bruyne shouldn’t be affected too much and if anything might be aided if he joined. I would be concerned for my Jesus and Sterling holds to a degree through. I personally think Jesus will leave if after waiting this long to take over the reigns from Agüero they slap him in the face by bringing in a 33 year old ahead of him in the pecking order.

    I feel if City offer 100m and talented players for him (as some reports are saying) then they’re off their minds for just one or two seasons at best and will hand Liverpool the title again. They should be planning long term unless Pep is going all out for champions league this season before leaving.

    Good luck to those who hold him but I’m happy to just watch the circus unfold.



  • @Erased-Citizen I think based on their squad atm City are favourites for the title, bringing in Messi will just be a stunt to try and slay their Champions League demons. It's a gamble but I'm not sure it's worth splashing 100m plus players like Silva. Garcia etc like you mentioned.

    If he's a free transfer, no brainer I guess. Could be the final piece of the jigsaw and bring out the best in those around him culminating in European success or it could turn into a bit of a farce - Pep shoehorning him in, upsetting their top players etc.

    Would be great to watch unfold like you say if it happens.



  • I think, from a Messi-holder perspective, if he comes to the premier league then PB is an afterthought.
    He will be an absolute media whore!
    This move changes his profile for me, and as i am not a fan of media holds, i'd consider selling him if he is not quite hitting form or isnt coping with life in the premier league.

    He's returning that £8+ share price in divs if he goes to city though.



  • There is no reason Messi cannot slide in easily to the team . He is not stepping on KDB toes if anything he is providing more assists.

    I'm not convinced by Jesus and a number of players were already being touted to leave as in Cancelo and Garcia anyway............

    Without a doubt he makes them a better team and the person most likely to suffer is Mahrez who again is bit part.



  • @howsthebacon said in KDB, Messi & City:

    @Erased-Citizen I think based on their squad atm City are favourites for the title, bringing in Messi will just be a stunt to try and slay their Champions League demons. It's a gamble but I'm not sure it's worth splashing 100m plus players like Silva. Garcia etc like you mentioned.

    If he's a free transfer, no brainer I guess. Could be the final piece of the jigsaw and bring out the best in those around him culminating in European success or it could turn into a bit of a farce - Pep shoehorning him in, upsetting their top players etc.

    Would be great to watch unfold like you say if it happens.

    I think City will be favourites if they strengthen even more defensively as even with the signing of Ake I think they look vulnerable. Bookies have them favourites already but I’m happy to go against the bookies yet again with Liverpool as 7/4 second favourites.

    I think Messi will be a bad thing for them and will upset the dynamics in their squad but if Pep is wanting to go out as a champions league winner and not worrying what he leaves the incoming manager, then who knows.

    Interesting times!



  • @Erased-Citizen talk of Koulibaly being a done deal...have to be confident with him and Laporte at the back! Ake and Otamendi aren't bad for back up. Stones will leave I'm guessing if Koulibaly is brought in.



  • @howsthebacon said in KDB, Messi & City:

    @Erased-Citizen talk of Koulibaly being a done deal...have to be confident with him and Laporte at the back! Ake and Otamendi aren't bad for back up. Stones will leave I'm guessing if Koulibaly is brought in.

    Yeah Koulibaly would be a good addition but even he’s not a spring chicken. Otamendi is a liability. Both him and Luiz of Arsenal are shocking defenders haha.



  • @Erased-Citizen feels a bit like when Fergie brought in Van Persie for a one season push before retiring. Long term, Messi at 33 is a backward step (if it comes at the loss of, or stunts the progression of, some younger talent) but even though his best days were a few years ago, him and Ronaldo were so far ahead of everyone else that he is probably still the best player in the world right now. If Pep could get a good season out of him, to help him win the CL, I think he'd be delighted with that.



  • @Mintyfresh said in KDB, Messi & City:

    @Erased-Citizen feels a bit like when Fergie brought in Van Persie for a one season push before retiring. Long term, Messi at 33 is a backward step (if it comes at the loss of, or stunts the progression of, some younger talent) but even though his best days were a few years ago, him and Ronaldo were so far ahead of everyone else that he is probably still the best player in the world right now. If Pep could get a good season out of him, to help him win the CL, I think he'd be delighted with that.

    Agree with that, apart from he’s the second best player in the world to Ronaldo but that’s just my opinion haha.

    I wouldn’t want to be a holder though as MB will dry up a little and PB will be non-existent if things don’t get sorted and he’s left on the sidelines. Plus with his age you need a get out plan. Too risky for me.



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  • Christ, all this is irrelevant to the thread title. Post all this on the Messi thread. Comments regarding the affect it’ll have on KDBs and Messi’s PB please.

    But fwiw signing Messi would be a shrewd move for City’s global appeal. Atm they have very little and this could put them on the map. So I think Messi is an investment which would make them a fortune on global merchandise etc.



  • @chaps1988 it's a bit of an unknown IMO. I think its widely agreed that ppl like Frenkie have been fairly indifferent for PB because everything goes through Messi. It's probably true. But there are question marks.

    We have never seen Barca with Messi, at least not since FI was around.

    But then weve seen almost nothing of Frenkie before Barca.

    Expectation was Frenkie would be one of the best under 23 midfielders on FI in terms of PB. He does strike as the type as well. So is he just not the player we thought, or is it because Messi is such a force?

    Is it simply because Messi takes every set piece?

    If so, will he take every set piece at City?

    Is this the only detriment he has put on Frenkie? If so, will KDB suffer that fate?
    Or is it just something intrinsic about Messi's game that creates the PB black hole around him?
    Is KDB so good that he can still put numbers up even in Messi's presence?

    My feeling is that Messi will hurt KDB's output.

    But is Messi at the stage of his career where hes gonna become a deadly centre forward in the way CR7 has gone?

    Will this boost KDBs figures even further?

    I'm not sure because whilst Messi is from another planet, KDB has just about the best genuine centre forward on the planet in front of him already in Aguero. But I would think that Messi as a CF would be less of a black hole. For example, we see Dybala putting excellent numbers up in the presence of CR7.

    So a lot depends on the role Messi adopts at City, but I think it creates a lot of question Mark's and at this point, I think it makes KDB significantly less appealing



  • @chaps1988 I suppose it's all relevant to the extent that the impact on KDB will depend upon how Messi settles and what he's got left.

    Messi is not the player he was; last year was his lowest goals return for several seasons and he ended up playing deeper than we've seen before on many occasions. Against that, he had more assists, so I think he is unlikely to come in, start dribbling round everyone and dominate PB, as that's not so much his game anymore (well certainly not on such a regular basis). It's more likely he would have to work in tandem with KDB, so if Messi settles well, I actually think his arrival could help bring up KDB's base score. The downside is KDB is probably going to see less of set pieces. There's also the risk, small in my opinion though, that Messi's arrival could put a few noses out of joint and damage team spirit, especially if everything did start to go through him. That would definitely be negative for KDB's PB prospects.

    Finally, KDB actually has a higher PB score than Messi over the past year (204 v 191)
    so it's by no means guaranteed, even if Messi is able to replicate his Barcelona form in the PL, that he'd take star man from KDB anyway, as although Messi is capable of huge PB scores, he doesn't necessarily always produce them on a consistent basis.

    In short, I hold neither but largely given Messi's age and his apparent gradually diminishing impact, I wouldn't be unduly concerned about the impact on KDB's PB at the moment.



  • @MickTurbo I was typing away when you're post appeared and although I am inclined to think KDB's PB prospects won't be unduly harmed, I agree the unknown impact and the almost certain loss of some set piece duties means I'd be reluctant to buy KDB now. Will also be interesting to see whether Messi pushes further forward like Ronaldo, or if he drops fully into a deeper mid role. He's more than capable of doing either!



  • @Mintyfresh said in KDB, Messi & City:

    @MickTurbo I was typing away when you're post appeared and although I am inclined to think KDB's PB prospects won't be unduly harmed, I agree the unknown impact and the almost certain loss of some set piece duties means I'd be reluctant to buy KDB now. Will also be interesting to see whether Messi pushes further forward like Ronaldo, or if he drops fully into a deeper mid role. He's more than capable of doing either!

    City are so dominant messi doesnt need drop deep, he’ll just play that right wing role drifting in role and score at least 30 goals from there.
    Can you imagine a city player NOT passing him the ball - going to be on it all the time.



  • @Mintyfresh I'm inclined to agree with @Tom77 in the sense that Messi will play off the right. Whilst I think he may eventually become the centre forward, you probably arent gonna spend colossal money on a 33 year old to plonk him in the CF role, when hes spent his entire career on the right, doing things that nobody else on the planet is capable of!

    Therefore, I think it is more detrimental to Mahrez or Silva, and I think 1 of them will be off. But as Tom says, or was it you? KDB will undoubtedly lose at least some free kicks. I suspect he may keep penalties but nonetheless I do think his output will diminish in terms of baseline and the regularity of those gigantic peaks weve seen him put up.

    What I dont think, is that its gonna be catastrophic. Divs are the only true barometer of value, and theyve just doubled. So what was worth a 5er is now worth a tenner in theory. Therefore, I do not anticipate KDBs price to tank, I expect it to rise, but where it may have jettisoned over the coming season, I think it will probably grow more or less in line with the footie, and his yields, whilst probably bigger than ever because of the increases, will be less regular and less predictable, but as I said in my previous post, there are so many unknowns



  • @chaps1988 said in KDB, Messi & City:

    Christ, all this is irrelevant to the thread title. Post all this on the Messi thread. Comments regarding the affect it’ll have on KDBs and Messi’s PB please.

    But fwiw signing Messi would be a shrewd move for City’s global appeal. Atm they have very little and this could put them on the map. So I think Messi is an investment which would make them a fortune on global merchandise etc.

    The title thread is KDB, Messi and City, so apologies for discussing KDB, Messi and City lol



  • I can't see Messi coming in and him or Pep suddenly switching or demanding all or most set pieces are taken by him as that's something else that will potentially upset the apple cart and team (moral, etc).

    'IF' City get him then he needs to be moulded into the City set-up rather than City moulding everything around him as I think that would be a mistake, especially with it being such a short-term thing.


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