Amount of Shares to show value

  • Been on here a few years but never really post. I noticed recently the floor on a lot of players massively reduced and bids firming up on them. I feel we need this across the board and that it will come now in the near future. On the other hand considering there is near 1million sanchos why do we let 900 shares dictate the buy now price. Even at 12 price levels there were point tonight I could only see 200 shares available be not the prices above that. Should we be reading buy now from firm holders looking to sell? Or average of say 5000? This would give a firmer read on where serious sellers value rather than the 30 people outbidding each other on the same shares. Would also stop manipulation.? At current I could reduce the price of a few players heavily with slapping 900 shares lower. I agree 900 should be my max but with 900 being the volume to move prices it doesn’t make sense. Thoughts ?

  • My first post by the way was way after I joined index before someone try’s to say I’ve only been on a year

  • Its actually really simple. They need to have the same number on the buy side and sell side for the measure.

    The sell side could have up to 1 million offers so not really a problem having any number make up the average.

    The number of buy offers is the problem, most players struggle to have 900 offers on them even when the market has no liquidity so offers stick around longer. So 900 is sort of the maximum they can have until there are far more buy offers on the market.

    The "best measure" would be for the number of shares making up the average to be the daily volume for that player, so top 100 players that traded 5000 shares a day would have an average of 5000 on the buy and sell side and less traded players would have much smaller number of shares to make up the average. Then the averages would be meaningful.

    The issue here would be the players that have no trading volume and in fact completely frozen, in this case a warning to let users know the risk or a lower bounds of say 50 shares could be used.

    Either way interesting topic.

  • I thought the buy side was already only 300 shares. I see the idea of increasing the VWAP on the sell side to 5000 shares a lot on twitter and I don't really get it.

    This would make the "buy now" price even more unrealistic to be almost meaningless - the average number of shares bought in a transaction must be well below 100. Users can already see the avg offer price - which must be similar for a lot of players to this proposed higher buy now price anyway?

    Do we really want Sancho with a sell now price of £6 and a "buy now" price of £9???

    What FI should do is incorporate the market depth into the listing page and the buy/sell dialogues better. They could also allow users to specify a number of shares or value for a benchmark price.

  • To some people it may be unrealistic to have Sancho for example showing a buy now higher than what you can see within the 12 offers. But for me it would tell me where people feel his true value is. I’m not bothered what one person is willing to sell 300 at out of 1million as this should be a small number easily past if someone is willing to buy. I want to know where the clog up of shares on offer is. Where the wall is of someone selling 3000 shares or 5000 shares. At the moment we are easily manipulated by idiots. I would happily list my shares of sancho at say £9 if I felt this was helping the market get a true representation but at the moment there is no point as it goes unrecognised. If someone was to list 3000sancho at a price I would be more interested in this 100 50 1 5 20 shit we see. Percentage shares per player would work 1% of player shares on offer average price

    There are 1 million shares out there and we are letting possibly 2 or 3 people use 0.01 percent to dictate the price.

    If there were 1000 of the same car for sale and 998 of them were up for sale at £10,000 and 2 at £8,000 I would assume the car is worth £10,000 not £8,000.

    We are currently being led to believe it worth £8,000 as a small percentage want to sell cheap.

    Just a thought. If people could see where the real heavy holders and traders valued there players I think the bids would soon catch up?

  • @NewUser291241 that is a fairly depressing thought if true.

  • Ansu fati is a good example at current. Buy price £2.92

    There are 300 on offer at £2.75 then not even 100 other shares on offer up to the max we can see at 3.25. So one person offering 300 is Si stating the whole price. Clear those I’m guessing we jump to £3.25 minimum. That’s 50p swing for 300 shares out of the 150,000 owned. (Guessing that figure but know it’s shown somewhere )

  • @NewUser291241 said in Amount of Shares to show value:

    If there were 1000 of the same car for sale and 998 of them were up for sale at £10,000 and 2 at £8,000 I would assume the car is worth £10,000 not £8,000.

    If the car was worth £10,000, the two at £8,000 would be snapped up pretty quickly.

    If the £8,000 aren't selling, you would assume that the cars are worth less than £8,000.

  • I do understand what your saying but at times when people are struggling to work out a value a few are led by what they can see.

    And the car example to fati we be more like 1000 cars at the same and 1 car lower in comparison to shares out there and the small amount offered lower.

    The biggest problem we have is people are spent out. If I could buy those 300 fati I would buy we are all spread thin.

    And new money will want to see where the bulk of share holders value there shares to see that what they are buying is a bargain.?

    Just trying to work out a way for us to get some stable values.

  • @NewUser291241

    People can already see the average offer price. Lets not dilute the "buy" price by adding prices that holders think a player is worth, which is after all subjective.

    Another feature in addition to making better use of the depth may be to show the last traded price.

    Edit - I'm not even sure how many people really list at any particular price they think is fair value anyway, they just add 10% on to what they bought for and forget about it.

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