Order Book



  • Does any think market manipulation could happen around a player? People posting big buy or sell orders just above or below market to make in look like a player will move one way. Or if they see a player hasn't got much support they could tank that player. Or if they see a player they can pump because there isn't may sell orders, they could pump and dump.



  • Can someone explain to me what is this order book please, I have seen it mentioned so many times but I still don’t know what it is. Thanks in advance





  • Order books are brilliant news and I have been advocating them for months, Like most people on here guessed they will look very similar to the betfair exchange and allow you to set prices you are prepared to pay for a player and prices you will sell for.

    The most positive thing is it allows us to become the benefactor of those that want to sell a player quickly as we can buy at a price similar to the instant sell price.

    I really think it will massively increase trading and prove really positive.

    For those who are panicking about instant sell disappearing FI will still provide liquidity and probably be a buyer of last resort at a similar low price as happens now.



  • @Misto There's an ex stock market guy who has voiced concerns about this on his website blog. Maybe someone here knows the name.



  • @Ollie

    It is very difficult to manipulate, have you used betfair exchange - works identical when wanting to bet or lay a bet. It has more turnover I believe than any other website and yet still regularly offers the punter better odds than a bookmaker. When it first started the spreads were massive but now they are very tight.

    Also if you see lots of money to buy or sell a player it is up to you to make of it what you want



  • @Fletch That's all over my head that stuff, just passing on that he has a view on it. I won't be taking any notice of it!



  • The crux of it is that you should be able to buy players cheaper than at present and sell them at better prices than instant sell in 90% of cases.



  • @Misto Here's the guy who has views on it. http://footballindextrader.co.uk/
    Check out the guides section 'Understanding Buy and Sell orders



  • Like he says you have to be aware, however just because it looks like lots of people want to buy or sell a player you should be making your own judgment and using that information as just another part of your decision making process. In the first few weeks lots of people will make mistakes just like when you 1st joined FI but in no time at all it will settle down and people will think why was this not here before as it will be a huge improvement



  • @Fletch said in Order Book:

    @Ollie

    It is very difficult to manipulate, have you used betfair exchange - works identical when wanting to bet or lay a bet. It has more turnover I believe than any other website and yet still regularly offers the punter better odds than a bookmaker. When it first started the spreads were massive but now they are very tight.

    Also if you see lots of money to buy or sell a player it is up to you to make of it what you want

    There is no point in manipulating the betfair exchange. There are hundread of other websites offering the same markets, so even if you move the price in betfair people would just use bet365 ect to place the bet. You would never beable to move the market more than say 10% because other bookies are acting as brench marks.

    Yes, you could use your best judgement, and I feel i'm very unlikly to get stung by any shenanigans. Other people will. As touched on in the blog Ollie linked, aside from placing large fake buy and sell orders to create a fake market perception. A pump and dump target could be found and executed.

    Eg.

    • Me and my group slowly take up a position in a fringe player being careful not to move the price up to much.

    • We then make posts saying something along the lines of "fringe player X has been linked with Manchester United, he's been seen at the trainging ground"

    • We then start buying on massive into the market starting the pump.

    • People see the posts, check out the player see he is pumping and jump in. With out any reserch, becuase they fear missing out. Momentum takes over.

    • Me and my group now start selling into the buys, making our profit because we took a early position before we started the pump.

    Now while as I said i'm pretty confident I wouldn't get burnt. I would not be happy if it destoryed market confidence in players I hold long term.



  • To take a decent position in a fringe player across a group would push the price up - think currently every 100 bought pushes price up 1p so for it to be worthwhile you and your group would already have pushed price up and own plenty - the key to order books is that it really does become an interactive platform where buying and selling will require skill. It is also a form of gambling so some buyer beware is required people who do not do any research deserve what they get - Currently they buy goalkeepers who will never return anything!!



  • so my take on an order book (please correct me if i'm wrong) is that you can set your price to buy and sell and when it hits that price the transactions will proceed?... and you can still instantly buy and sell if needs be?

    So in effect it should be better for everyone?

    Perhaps i'm wrong as I don't sit in on these meets? But is this not better for everyone???

    If Ronaldo hits £15... I can instantly sell if i set my selling order to 15? If he drops to £10... I can instantly buy if i set my buying order to 10?? But if i wanted to buy him today i would pay £13.12 or if i wanted to sell him today i would sell for £12.53 instantly???

    So in theory the sale queue can be set higher????

    If someone could clear it up that would be great!!!



  • @dannypea Your understanding is correct. It should also add more liquidity to the market.



  • @Misto so if that's correct the IS would still be there in effect as a safety net? The only change is that we set the IS level?

    @Fletch is that how you understand it? My understanding from what you wrote earlier is that someone would have to buy at whatever price I set for me to sell? Whether it's 1p or £2 below their current price??



  • @dannypea nope. No instant sell, still need someone to buy.



  • I hate the uncertainty of this.

    My limited understanding; if it works like Betfair then someone needs to buy.
    If it works like trading commodities you set a sell order and the market provider buys.

    Can anyone show confirmation of which way they're going?? Or are we speculating?



  • I didn't understand the explanation on this last night, but I think it sounded like Betfair with an order book, someone needs to buy. And I think IS will still be there. Need more conformation from others there from the bar chat afterwards, or official.



  • I've used betfair for over 20 years.....the key advantage for us punters with the order book system is the transparency of the liquidity levels.....it will allow increased confidence in your trades which supports you to execute exit strategies from individual trades with confidence. Very exciting and along with the great marketing FI are doing, I expect big increases in the level of traders and more importantly how much they are depositing!



  • So no instant sale to market??? Which is something I use frequently especially on injury news or transfers or to flip for a new/better growth future so on hearing this I would say it puts my strategy more at risk?? Eg if Ronaldo gets a career threatening injury tomorrow we can't instantly sell as we have to set an order sale price and if his price has already gone below that we are screwed???


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